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magic1313Offline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Oct 07, 2004 - 11:56 AM
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I do offer combined shipping, I just assumed that this was understood unless otherwise stated. The Catalogue number is different from the label number I have listed? (another number beside the one used to look it up in a price guide?)
 
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scotapellOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Oct 07, 2004 - 12:05 PM
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The one you have listed is the Cat number. (The number used in price guides) That's usually the one that people will look for first.
Lp matrix numbers and cat numbers usually match to an extent with a a/b or 1/2 added to distinguish sides. There may also be a M or S for mono or stereo. Matrix numbers on 45s often are a number identifying the song and will not match the catalog number at all.

Different pressings had all kinds of words, letters, numbers or symbols that collectors can use to identify specific pressings or even counterfeits.

Scot

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magic1313Offline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Oct 07, 2004 - 03:55 PM
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Thanks for all of your help scot. Any more would be appreciated if you happen to think of something later
 
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Post subject:   PostPosted: Oct 07, 2004 - 11:53 PM
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magic1313 wrote:
Is the matrix number the one in the dead wax aand where can I find the cat #.

Supplemental to scotapell's reply, the matrix no. is often printed on the label, and duplicated (with additional letter/numerals) in the groove trailoff (or dead wax) area. Depending on the pressing, the numbers used can refer to different aspects of the recording and duplicating process: on US pressings (those I'm most familiar with) the "matrix number" may be [a] simply the catalog number (with an identifier to distinguish the side, like -A and -B, or -1 and -2), [b] the record company's own master reference number (used on all instances of a particular recording), or [c] the pressing plant's job number, which may vary from one pressing of a particular recording to another. Capitol Records, for instance, used [a] on their LPs and [b] on their 45s, while Columbia Records used [c].

The catalog no. is usually found on the album's cover or single's picture sleeve, and repeated on the disk's labels (both sides).
 
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drlp
Post subject: Record grading  PostPosted: Nov 10, 2004 - 12:37 PM
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I have over 14000 records, mostly classical, and have been tussling with the rating question for years. Posts about scratches and scuffs-I've had records with scratches and scuffs that simply don't sound. Therefore simply stating whether such a defect is there doesn't necessarily mean what you might infer it to mean. A further problem I have had is that the same disc can sound much different on different systems! My Linn LP12,Van den Hull cartridge, and standard exposure (solid state) amp+preamp defines the music wonderfully but is just as good at bringing out every little click and hiss.
A friend of mine with a Linn LP12 but with a more tubelike rest of the system that makes some records sound a full grade better than on my system. Both expensive set-ups. And I've purchased records on ebay that I might have been upset feeling the record was over graded but in retrospect I'm not so sure..
But we can't solve all of these issues...

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scotapellOffline
Post subject: Re: Record grading  PostPosted: Nov 10, 2004 - 01:25 PM
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drlp wrote:

But we can't solve all of these issues...


I think this is part of the reason this thread seems to have stalled out. Play grades are great, but, as you mentioned a more sensitive system will often result in a lower grade. I would think a visual grade along with a play grade of problem areas would suffice without having to drop a grade.

I think the discussion needs to first determine what effects grade and to what extent before continuing on with a numerical or alphabetical grading system.

Scot

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ks45
Post subject:   PostPosted: Nov 10, 2004 - 02:04 PM
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I remember years ago when the local libraries loaned out vinyl LPs and how they checked the on-going damage to their stock..each disc had a card showing two circles representing the faces of the LP in question..and when you checked it out the main scratches on the discs were compared with the card..cant e-bay sellers have this kind of visual grading or would they prefer to pretend that discs dont ever get marked?
 
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londoner
Post subject:   PostPosted: Nov 28, 2004 - 06:47 PM
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Hello. When I sell records on ebay I grade them as I would expect them to be graded if I bought them - looking at each one quite closely - if there is even one tiny paper scratch then it's EX. NM would be perfect. I don't use Mint out of principle, for fear of people finding a speck of dust on it then leaving me bad feedback. I try and under rate them a little bit, really good apparently NM looking recs usually end up EX or EX- by the time I've examined them under various angles of light.

I've found that most people's rating system on ebay isn't really up to much - I tend to find most of them are overgraded by about one grade (example - described as NM usually I find is EX or EX- by my personal grading system), so I take this into account when buying items. On the other hand a few sellers have really suprised me with very good shiny items.

BTW - I think there's something to be said for the old fashioned system of "Fair" (Unplayable- a collection filler) , "VG" (A decent well looked after copy) and "NM" (As good as you can get or sealed or new etc.), forcing the seller to make a definite commitment to one of these three categories, therefore most records off ebay would have to be classed as "VG" in my opinion.

This RCG feedback thing - are you lot saying that we should put this at the end of every person we buy a record off's feedback, so we can start to evaluate the sellers ratings?
 
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scotapellOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Nov 28, 2004 - 09:58 PM
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londoner wrote:
This RCG feedback thing - are you lot saying that we should put this at the end of every person we buy a record off's feedback, so we can start to evaluate the sellers ratings?


That's the idea. If enough of us start using it we will eventually start seeing it in seller's feedback. As you said, many sellers tend to over grade. A few, like yourself it sounds, grade conservatively. This would give us a little more info than the positive/negative feedback system currently used on ebay.

Scot

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wmc64123Offline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Dec 11, 2004 - 02:57 AM
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I like the RCG code idea. Let's do it or is this already in progress? I have my own grading system which is posted at the bottom on All of my LP auctions. I think this is needed as so many have pointed out because I just don't know about what some people think. Here it is:

GRADING: PLEASE READ

I must be clear about this. I grade visually. What I see is what you get. I don't use record guide grading any more. There seems to be too many different people with too many different ideas about what the different grades mean. What I can say is my physical description of records is accurate based on 30+ years of experience viewing high quality records. I will simply say that all of my records are "clean" in that they look nice and should play extremely well. But I do have a grading system to make it easier to identify how I grade and it provides a common frame of reference for everybody. The grading system is as follows:

NEAR MINT (NM): Nearly perfect. I use this grade in two ways. If I look at a record and see absolutely nothing wrong with it in any way whatsoever it is a NM record. I also use this grade to describe a record which might have an extremely minor imperfection such as very small scuff mark or surface scratch. On the jackets, it may have a very small cut-out hole or a very light white area on one corner of the jacket. Certainly nothing which places it far from perfect and nothing in combination. I grade very conservatively and many of my VG+ records are called NM by some. I have many records which look this way.

VERY GOOD PLUS (VG+) OR EXCELLENT: There will be some signs of wear on the record. Perhaps a handful or less of small, light scuff marks or surface scratches which do not affect the sound. The jacket may have any of the following imperfections but certainly not many combined: cut-out hole, smaller corner bends, light ring/edge wear, small initials, etc. Something more serious in nature like a seam split does not qualify. The main point being is that these defects do not detract from the appearance of the cover very much if at all.

VERY GOOD (VG): The most misunderstood of all grades. The record may or may not play with noise. Must be play tested to be sure (which I usually don't do unless fairly expensive Lp). Visually, there will be signs of wear on the record. A noticeable number of surface scratches or scuff marks and perhaps longer than usual. However, I do not sell records with deep scratches which can be felt by the fingernail. The jacket may have any of the flaws which might be present in a VG+ jacket except with more in combination. May even have a small seam split. Nothing large. I don't sell records which have large seam splits. This cover should be reasonable in appearance although somewhat distracting to the eye.
_____________
That's it..and it serves me well. There are a HUGE number of records which are between grades of Goldmine VG and VG+. You go from an excellent copy with no noise to one which has scrtaches which can be felt and are surely noisy. This is simply not the case and why I devised my system. Most people will not touch a VG rec unless rare. On a rare occasion, I will add Strong VG+..but that gets into verbage again. On the other hand, it puts it between the two grades. I also list defects in my recs when they are not Near Mint. This helps but is time consuming.

Cheers,

Michael
 
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